posted
ONWUKA-----------------> I read your response with amusement and frankly in my personnal opinion, I don't give a damn about you bleeding heart for Saddam Hussein.My biggest bone of contention is the freedom for Iraqi people and disposal of weapon's of biology. With your version of moral and confounding contempt for George W intent over a blood thirsty detector and with no compassion for the people of Iraqi. I found your opinion an infraction and jaggedly edged on your quest for Biafra. You have failed to define the real meaning of the word freedom over a Kahki President, loaded with biological weapon. You cannot diminish the dusty record of Saddam without having to feel for the oppressed. If Biafra actually means a lot to you, you should repudiate all forms of detectorship..and Abacha is no different from Saddam. Everybody agrees that Saddam must be removed from power to liberate the Iraqis and strip of him of the weapon's biology but how do you accomplish that without the merit of war?
I will lend you my ears when your assessment of GW is balanced without highly prejudiced. In the mean time, read, digest and minimize your hell raising on GW perhaps you will sound more convincing.
Hail Biafra
[ March 21, 2003, 10:35 AM: Message edited by: Waypoint1Biafra ]
Posts: 1672 | From: Minnesota USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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40 nations minus Nigerian Obasanjo and Islamic Republic of Northern Nigeria supports the war against Saddamned. Cameroonian President with a 140 million dollar French investment in 2002, snubbed the government. They were haild to have given a key vote to America in the UN Security Council has been invited to the White house for dinner with the President of the free world---------> GW, possibly laying a foundation for assistance in the future for the Bakkassi penisular, isolating Obasanjo.
Hail Biafra
[ March 21, 2003, 08:53 AM: Message edited by: Waypoint1Biafra ]
Posts: 1672 | From: Minnesota USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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Sorry I still dont buy your arguement in favour of this war. Is it moral ?
Is it legal?
Democracy which you and other neocons espouse includes the freedom of choice. It should not be imposing your values on ther peoples. The empires you mentioned made the mistakes that the americans are making today, that is their way of life is better. What understanding do the Americans have of the Iraqi peoples and culture.The mistakes of the Vietnam war/involvement dont seem to have been learnt.
quote:Americans again tried to impose their values on the country of Vietnam, without understanding the culture and the religion of Vietnam
Col. David Hackworth
Saddam and his regime will probably be gone in a few days time, that is when the real problems will begin .
Suppose the New Iraq decides to vote in a party with an Islamic agenda, what then will your support for democracy in iraq be?
We very easily forget what happened in Algeria. The FIS in their manifesto stated that the would abolise universal suffrage if voted into power, the electorate voted them in, the military cancelled the election.
Posts: 585 | From: London. | Registered: Mar 2001
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quote:possibly laying a foundation for assistance in the future for the Bakkassi penisular, isolating Obasanjo.
I had the same inclination when I read about his invitation to the WH.
Having said that, I think Paul Biya is one of the many problems that are confronting Africa in terms of sits tight President. This is a guy who took over the reign of government from Ahidjo, and ever since then, he has refused to leave.
Paul will have his dinner with Dubya and photo ops too, but if he banks on US support in the imbroglio of Bakkassi, he must have another think coming his way.
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WPIBiafra: I hate to read you suggesting that I am in support of Saddam Hussien regime with all it's atrocities, my concern is the odinary people of Iraq and will not give a damm if Mr. Hussien is eliminated, this Iraqis like odinary people all over the world are venurable and exposed to a great dangerous situation and imminent death on a conflict that is not of their own making. Let me state clearly that i do addmire the Americans and it's way of like but not when it is brandishing dengrious weapons and military wares to intimidate weaker countries and their citizen into submmision. Where is the legal and moral backing of this aggresion by Mr. Bush?, what is the prove of Saddams weapon of mass destruction?,why should the inspections sanctioned by the UN not continue to get ride of any dangerious weapons that might be in possesion of Saddam Hussien by peacefull means? where are the aggresive steps taking by Hussien outside his the shores of Iraq after he was chased out of Kuwait by the allied forces in the first gulf war, why did G. Bush the first not support the Iraqi opposition to topple Saddam in 1991? has the contianment not worked all these years? what is this need for war if not OIL?.
___________________ He likened the second coming of Christ to the realisation of the Biafran dream, stating that at a time people least expect, the much sought Biafra would be a reality..Rev. Fr. Cornelius Ezeiloaku Posts: 622 | From: santiago, chile | Registered: Jan 2002
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quote: Mr. Bush Jr, who is said never to forget even relatively minor slights, has alarmed analysts with the way in which he has allowed senior administration figures such as Donald Rumsfeld, the Defence Secretary, aggressively to criticise France and Germany.
quote: He also urged the president to resist his tendency to bear grudges
Bush Snr warns son over unilateral action
Friday, March 21, 2003
WASHINGTON DC—THE first President Bush has told his son that hopes of peace in the Middle East would be ruined if a war with Iraq were not backed by international unity. Drawing on his own experiences before and after the 1991 Gulf War, Mr. Bush Sr said that the brief flowering of hope for Arab-Israeli relations a decade ago would never have happened if America had ignored the will of the United Nations. He also urged the president to resist his tendency to bear grudges, advising his son to bridge the rift between the United States, France and Germany. You’ve got to reach out to the other person. You’ve got to convince them that long-term friendship should trump short-term adversity, he said. The former President’s comments reflect unease among the Bush family and its entourage at the way that George W. Bush is ignoring international opinion and overriding the institutions that his father sought to uphold. Mr. Bush Sr is a former US Ambassador to the UN and comes from a family steeped in multi-lateralist traditions.
Although not addressed to his son in person, the message, in a speech at Tufts University in Massachusetts, was unmistakeable. Mr. Bush Sr even came close to conceding that opponents of his case against President Saddam Hussein, who he himself is on record as loathing, have legitimate cause for concern. He said that the key question of how many weapons of mass destruction Iraq held could be debated. The case against Saddam was less clear than in1991, when Mr. Bush Sr led an international coalition to expel invading Iraqi troops from Kuwait. Objectives were a little fuzzier today, he added.
After the Gulf War, Mr.Bush Sr steered Israel and its Arab neighbours to the Madrid Conference, a stepping stone to the historic Israeli-Palestinian Oslo accords, in much the same way that the present president has talked about the removal of Saddam as opening the way to a wider peace in the region. In an ominous warning for his son, Mr. Bush Sr said that he would have been able to achieve nothing if he had jeopardised future relations by ignoring the UN. The Madrid conference would never have happened if the international coalition that fought together in Desert Storm had exceeded the UN mandate and gone on its own into Baghdad after Saddam and his forces.
Also drawing on the lessons of 1991, he said that it was imperative to mend fences with allies immediately, rather than waiting until after a war. He had been infuriated with the decision of King Hussein of Jordan to side with Saddam rather than the US, but while criticising the Jordanian leader in public and freezing $41 million in US aid, he also passed word to King Hussein that he understood his domestic tensions.
Mr. Bush Jr, who is said never to forget even relatively minor slights, has alarmed analysts with the way in which he has allowed senior administration figures such as Donald Rumsfeld, the Defence Secretary, aggressively to criticise France and Germany.
There are, however, signs that Mr. Bush message may be getting through. Father and son talk regularly and it was, in part, pressure from Mr. Bush Sr’s foreign policy coterie, that helped to persuade the president to go to the UN last September.
___________________ Feel me? Ofu onye ana asi unu abia go. - Ednut Igbo-American . www.airamericaradio.com visit her. Posts: 2447 | From: Mother Earth | Registered: Mar 2001
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I know war as other men and women now living knows about it-------> as a Biafran. Because I have been there. The war I witnessed as a pre-teen is no civility but a monster of testimony of science and destruction. But it was a necesary evil just like Iraq.
It does not matter now, if it is moral or illegal. The war has started and we should all pray for the life of all affected. Support the American soldier whose life is on the line for you general welfare and pray for the innocent Iraqis cought between the war. We hope that America with her civilized army will minimize damage. "Shock and Awe" and selective target is a big step. Stop the argument.The next argument would be rebuilding Iraq.
Hail Biafra
[ March 21, 2003, 06:37 PM: Message edited by: Waypoint1Biafra ]
Posts: 1672 | From: Minnesota USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
I also was affected by the Biafranigerian civil war. I have also seen the effects of terrorism which incidentally depends a lot on fund raised in good old USA
quote:Support the American soldier whose life is on the line for you general welfare and pray for the innocent Iraqis cought between the war. We hope that America with her civilized army will minimize damage.
I cannot fathom how the American Soldier is putting his life on the for my general welfare. He is rather putting it on the line for the oil industry. Ednut, clearly stated that he would rather have cheaper gasoline, that, sirs is plain speaking. He has not tried to sell it as a fight for my freedom as some have tried to imply. People should not play on other peoples intelligence. How would kicking Saddam's butt free me from the the oppression of the Hausa/fulani and the Yoruba? I bet that they are not interested in what is happenning in BiafraNigeria because they already controll the oil.
I am surprised that you have such high regards for the American Military with regards to morality
It is indisputable that Saddam Hussein is an evil man, but he is not the only one. Here are a few of the charges labelled against him. Gassed his only people. So did GWB!
He massacred his own people. So did some chap in Odi, Benue,Okigwe etc
He killed his political opponents. He did not kill Harry Marshall.
He invaded another country. Not Panama.
He has weapons of mass destruction. So do USA, United kingdom, Isreal,Syria,India, Pakistan(The so called Islamic bomb)etc.
Yes the war is on, We should pray for all the soldiers involved, not just the Americans.
quote:When a corpse is being carried to it place of burial, to the strangers it feel as if it is a log of wood that is being carried.
posted
American Empire, so what? I see a lot of double standard here. For sure United States and its coalition on the attack to remove Saddam Hussein from his decades of tyranical regime has its merits and demerits of which the merits far outweighs the demerits.
First, the demerits which has to do with loss of innocent lives, coercion ("oil") and exercise of empire is the ultimate price to pay for freedom. For instance, when Adolf Hitler's Nazi Germany invaded nearly the whole of Europe, the idea behind that invasion was in no way a liberation for freedom but a domination to institute a state of empire and anarchy which of course resulted to persecution, ethnic cleansing and the Holocaust. So too was Japan's imperial powers in the Pacific states where sovereinties were overtaken, plundered and demolished for tyrany.
The merits and demerits differs significantly despite the enormous price being paid for freedom. If America had not intervened in Japan and Germany, who knows what the world would have looked like today in a state of empire and anarchy? Today Japan and Germany holds one of Globe's economic powers from America's intervention to avoid reigns of terror as instituted by Saddam's Iraq.
The same case applies to the Balkans, Soviet Union and Korea. South Korea, Kosovoians, Albanians, Bosnians, Tajiks, Asbeks, Uzbeks, Georgians, etc. are enjoying freedom and hope for future sound economic growth.
On the other hand, if Saddam had complied with United Nation's resolutions after twelve years of diplomacy to seek resolve, Iraq would have been free from invasion with him and his kids still in power.
Posts: 292 | Registered: Mar 2001
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Invaded for not complying with 12 UN resolotions! Isreal on the other hand has Ignored 35!
So he would have been left alone if had disarmed? So what is all the noise about liberating the Iraqi people? So he would have been left alone to continue to oppress his people?
It has become obvious to the rest of the world that the weapons inspection was very successful from the US point of view. It succeded in the disarmarment of Saddams Iraq, and provided the intelligence which contributed to the results we are witnessing at the moment. We will soon be witnessing one of the effects one this campaign namely the resumption of the arms race. As with the North Korean experience, any country now realises that once you possess nuclear weapons you will be free from attacks by the US.
Wacko you sound like an unsatisfiable virgin------------>despite all the responses from me and lately from Ambrose you still don't get it.The war is on, get over it. And if you cannot support the American soldier, you might as well support the British commandos for your general welfare, at least while your priviledged the same right with the indegenes. You have made your point to the left about blood and oil -------> too bad your source is Ednut and there is no evidence to support your claim. Frankly, it is well taken, any more point will be redundant.
Hail Biafra
[ March 21, 2003, 10:00 PM: Message edited by: Waypoint1Biafra ]
Posts: 1672 | From: Minnesota USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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I think you added an extra "http://" to your first link above. Yours was a very poignant link.
Americans who have grown used to watching war on CNN and MSNBC should ask themselves how many Septemeber 11s their presidents have created around the world.
The US is using cancer-causing depleted uranium bombs that leave children sick and maimed for life. And since when was the US so eager to see UN resolutions enforced? Wacko is right on the money.
Posts: 365 | Registered: Mar 2001
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I see you are making the mistake of those recently converted to a new religion. Don't believe much of what you hear or read concerning the need for the U.S. invasion of Iraq. It is far more complicated than wanting to bring about armed democracy in Iraq or to remove Saddam Hussein because of his weapons of mass destruction.
The decision to invade Iraq arose farther in the past than recent claims would want us to believe. Mr. Hussein did not recently become evil or get more interested in WMD. He is what he had always been a criminal and a thug. But the U.S had always known this even when they were supplying him with chemical and biological weapon specimen.
Saddam and Iraq are in trouble because the U.S. wants access to what they own - oil and its strategic place in the Arab world. The U.S. has always considered the Persian Gulf to be of strategic national interest because of the oil there. The mistake of countries like Iraq (and Iran) is the ambition of wanting to be the dominant power in their region. U.S. interest will not permit that. So Saddam Hussein has to go but more more than that, Iraq has to be re-made. That is the crux of the matter.
Weapons of mass destruction, Saddam Hussein being a dictator who poisons his own people are just distractions to confuse and deceive the innocent. Ask youself why after the chemical attack on the Kurds by Saddam Hussein, the United States expended much energy and resources to propagandize to the world that it was the Iranians, not the Iraqis who gassed the Kurds?
Thanks for the correction. I dont support Saddam, but the worrying thing how flawed all the arguments in favour of this war is. The antiterrorism argument has been used, however their has been more homegrown terrorist incidents in the US than those carried out by non Americans.
quote:You can never eradicate terrorism, once their is injustice their will always be terrorism. Stella Remington, former Director General of M15
No one has adequately conviced me that I would be safer from Ricin now that Saddam has fallen than I was last week.
Posts: 585 | From: London. | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
I have tried to detach myself from the horror going on in Iraq to no avail. The civilised american military does not seem to care that there is actually no one firing back. So civilised that they forewarned us of the shock and awe they planned for a defenceless people. This is not just an immoral war. It is also illegal. It is a preemptive war that its most articulate proponents, Tony Blair and Colin Powell, can't justify even to the most fair minded observers.
[ March 21, 2003, 11:27 PM: Message edited by: CSE ]
Posts: 621 | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
The world that will result from this Might-Is-Right military attack to expand the empire does not augur well for the planet. Some people are profitting from this re-colonization effort underway, but the largest majority of humans would do much better if the nations of the world are LEFT ALONE to compete on a level field. But, where is the domination, dictatorship and supremacy in that? It is clear this war is designed to expand supremacy, kill generalized economic prosperity on a world scale and retain a single-empire world domination, using the ideology of Might-is-Right.
The liberation of Iraq from Sadam is simply laughable.
[ March 22, 2003, 03:38 PM: Message edited by: Amadi O. ]
___________________ achieve Biafra and show the difference Posts: 642 | From: Los Angeles, CA | Registered: Nov 2002
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quote:The civilised american military does not seem to care that there is actually no one firing back. So civilised that they forewarned us of the shock and awe they planned for a defenceless people. This is not just an immoral war. It is also illegal. ~~By CSE
That is the Iraqi's catch 22. If they rise and fight back Bush and Blair will scream: Yeah, we told you he has weapons of Mass Destruction(WMD). But as they keep landing Hundreds of Millions of Dollars worth of Weapons Of Mass Destruction the spin is that "our armed forces are efficient". Efficiency my foot.
The casualties they have suffered so far have been self inflicted: Choppers colliding etc. And this coming after many months of planning and bragging about precision.
The one good thing about all these is that it will be over pretty quick and then we'll go back to the famous phrase: It's the economy stupid! i believe Bush Jr is using these wars as a smoke screen for his lousy and dumb economic policy. All this cack about Sadamn and Osama is baseless. It is a matter of public record that the Al Qaeda terrorists tried to assassinate Sadamn not once, but twice.
___________________ Awo's political idea was based on the assumption that any town beyond Owo was Igbo or Hausa. Awo was not socialised; he was not a good mixer because he did not have the opportunity, which the secondary school offered. ~TOS Benson, Baba Oba of Lagos Posts: 2644 | From: United Kingdom | Registered: Apr 2001
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The WAR on Iraq is like killing a mosquito with a sledge hammer.
Waypoint1, the problem I have with you is that you are not original,that all. I sometimes listen the same guys that you so much use as resourse but only for comic relieve. I recommend you do the same or a least spare us.
___________________ Feel me? Ofu onye ana asi unu abia go. - Ednut Igbo-American . www.airamericaradio.com visit her. Posts: 2447 | From: Mother Earth | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
While at it, let's take care of the other Axis of Evil.
quote: U.S. Apologizes to Iran for Errant Missile 4 minutes ago Add World - Reuters to My Yahoo!
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The United States has apologized to Iran for errant missiles fired at Iraq (news - web sites) that crashed inside Iranian territory, a U.S. official said on Saturday.
"We sent one message via the Swiss yesterday to the Iranians saying, 'sorry,' and may send another but we have to get the facts" first, the official told Reuters.
Iran, which is torn by its hatred for the two main protagonists in the war in Iraq, has blamed U.S. jets for firing three missiles that landed in southwestern Iran and accused U.S. and British forces of violating its airspace.
The U.S. military is investigating indications that a ship-launched American Tomahawk cruise missile fired at a target in Iraq went off course and perhaps landed in southwestern Iran, a defense official said on Saturday.
The other U.S. official said there may have been two separate events in which missiles went astray. "The second report of something falling was unclear" but is being checked out, he said.
posted
US/British Forces Engage in Turkey Shoot in Baghdad
The US/British perpetrated "awe and shock" carnage now going on in Baghdad is the best case that could be made that the UN and the undemocratic Security Council exist for the destruction of weak nations. The lessons from the ongoing Bush/Blair massacre in Iraq is that a small country's cooperation with UN disarmament programs will simply make it easier for that country to be destroyed by regimes, such as the British and Bush regimes, with imperialistic ambitions. If Iraq was going to go to war, it should never have allowed itself to be disarmed by the UN.
As Benbella has pointed out, the modified version of this imperialism resides in the US doctrine that the best way to remain the world's only superpower is to actively block the emergence regional powers such as Iraq, Iran, and others that the US and Britain have taken down in the post cold war era. The other instrument employed to foster US/British domination of the world is the strange nuclear Non Proliferation Treaty (NPT), under which most small countries, including BiafraNigeria, are forced to essentially accept that only the US and its "allies" or other comparably powerful nations could make and use nuclear weapons.
They call it "Operation Iraqi Freedom." But, clearly, this is nothing but the massacre of a defenseless people, a people rendered defenseless by UN arms inspections programs dating back to 1991.
We have been told that the weapons employed in this carnage are ultra-precision GPS satellite and Laser guided weapons. It makes one wonder why a cruise missile aimed at Iraq ended up in Iran.
___________________ You ain't seen nothing yet Posts: 150 | Registered: Mar 2001
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All: Away from the "welfare," "freedom for Iraqi people" PROPAGANDA from the American and British governments and their MIGHT-IS-RIGHT followers here and elswhere, one do not need to be a military expert to know that this SENSELESS war has ALL to with O-I-L and NOTHING to do with "freedom." for either the America, British or Iraqi peoples.
While we also agree with the pro-war members that the war has started, it is HEARTLESS for anyone to ask us to "pray" for American and other soldiers who have been obviously misled by their respective govermnets and as duty demands have NO OPTION than to fight this AVOIDABLE war.
The bigger question after Saddam and co (who are indeed BAD) are gone is CAN THE U.S. & CO BE ABLE TO MANAGE THE THE PEACE THEREAFTER?
Posts: 997 | From: Germany | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
An American traitor formerly a Christian became a moslem, changed his name from John Doe to Jihad. He was grouped in one of the most prestigious mechenized US army, stationed in Kuwait was the fanatic who tossed out several granades on his own people in the name of Allah. He killed one and injuring many. He was found hiding in a trench after a head count. His godamned defense was that the attack on Iraqi was not based on disarming Saddamned but on Islam. The bastard should have deserted instead of killing his own. What a joke.
I think the US government should be careful with these home grown American moslems. You can never be too careful with the mini Farrakkhans.
Hail Biafra
[ March 23, 2003, 10:19 PM: Message edited by: Waypoint1Biafra ]
Posts: 1672 | From: Minnesota USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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