posted
What good will a coup do to country at this time? The worst cilian rule is better than the best military rule. My vote is NO!
Posts: 81 | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Olu My vote still stand, if Obasanjo and PDP rigg their way to victory Army should overthrow them. Afterall we have shed more blood in three years of Obasanjo than 12 years of Military combined.
You are damn right, an election rigger is as bad as a coup plotter. If Aremu rigs the election then he has no case if the military kick him out.
Ednut
Do you think Buhari, Babangida, Abacha and co. were the most senior when they carried out their coup against Shagari? Did you not hear of generals begging majors during the Abacha days ? In the end the most determined group will seize power, rank is for chooping money.
Posts: 1534 | From: USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
What about this: If it is obvious that the elections are rigged, there should be a civilian uprising, starting from Umuahia (The Yorubas started the last one in Lagos), leading to sit-ins, civil disobedience, and chaos.. with the demand for a sovereign national conference where we can all sit down as equal partners in the equation called Nigeria, in order to fashion the way out. Do you still advocate a coup?
___________________ This war of attrition on the Igbo must end now! Posts: 441 | From: california, US | Registered: Jan 2003
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The Yoruba's started what? could you be more specific and why can't they vote Ojukwu who has already promised an SNC if that is what they really want?
Posts: 1534 | From: USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Specifically, the Yoruba began the agitation to remove Babangida from office after the unjust cancellation of the 1993 polls.The Elections are still about 3 weeks, I have not read a piece that said Ojukwu visited Yorubaland except once in Ibadan and Lagos, most of his campaign activities are concentrated in Igboland. Moreover, he adduced to the fact that he was not running in order to win, but to force a run-off. Why waste your vote on a non-starter?. Yorubas are more pragmatic than that, my brother.
quote:What about this: If it is obvious that the elections are rigged, there should be a civilian uprising, starting from Umuahia (The Yorubas started the last one in Lagos), leading to sit-ins, civil disobedience, and chaos.. with the demand for a sovereign national conference where we can all sit down as equal partners in the equation called Nigeria, in order to fashion the way out. Do you still advocate a coup?
___________________ addy
What's the essence of starting a civilian uprising when many civilians would be killed and the end not met?
___________________ IGBO AMAKA Posts: 83 | From: Porthacourt | Registered: Feb 2003
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posted
I cannot understand you lot who seem think that a rigged election is not the same as a coup.
from Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary)
quote:coup (d'état) noun [C] plural coups (d'état) a sudden illegal, often violent, taking of government power, especially by (part of) an army:
Please note that it states especially by (part of) an army, and not only by the army. I do not see an difference between Abacha shooting his way to Aso Rock and him 'getting' 99% of votes cast by the electorate. I am still waiting for Olu to tell me why he thinks that Rigging is the lesser of the two evils. I believe that people from western part of BiafraNigeria hold that view because their favoured son is in power. That was not their view when they felt that Awo was cheated out of the presidency in 1983. I could also recall the clamour for a military take over after the annulment of the June 12 election.
You might notice how they stabbed Ohaneze in the back after agreeing with Ohaneze not to bake any candidate that does not support SNC. Some on this board would like us to beleive that the western politician are principled. Some principle!
If and when the military return, any Igboman or anyone from the ethnic minorities who protest is a fool. They will just be fighting for the right to be oppressed by an individual instead of another.
Posts: 587 | From: London. | Registered: Mar 2001
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The agitation to remove Babangida was a sectional one limited to the south west, so how is that the same thing as Ndigbo starting a national uprising from Umuahia ? Besides I did not see the Yoruba stone Shonekan when he was used to pacify them albeit briefly, a coup cannot that bad afterall if you guys tolerated Shonekan and Diya.
Why would Ojukwu's visit to Ibadan and Lagos not be enough to arouse Yoruba interest if SNC is truly their wish ? Tell us did the PDP agree to SNC as part of the tribalistic arrangement with AD?
Posts: 1534 | From: USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
The rigging was was conceived by Tony Anenih, nurtured by Tom Ikimi and is being delivered by Guomodia. Is there something especially wrong with these folks from certain part of the country? I'm biginning to believe Obaseki when he said in another thread that the people from Edo-Middle Belt axis are Igbo's enemy Nr. 1.
Quote: -------------------------------------------------- "Anambra State accounted for the highest figure of disqualified applications, which total was put at 676,293 by the Commission, followed by Rivers State with 509,470."---Nigerian Vanguad. --------------------------------------------------
What other explanation other than RIGGING can be given for denying these people from certain parts of the country whose voting parten (they're likely not to vote for Obasanjo's PDP) can be guessed their BASIC RIGHTS?
Quote -------------------------------------------------- "At the bulk zonal level, the North West zone comprising Zamfara, Sokoto, Kebbi, Kano, Katsina, Kebbi and Jigawa States, has the highest voters of over 15 million, followed by the South-West (Lagos, Ondo, Oyo, Ogun, Osun, Ekiti States) with over 12 million. --------------------------------------------------
Suddenly, the Southwest and the North west where Obasanjo is expected to do well has more "registered voters" and curiously less or no prospective voter was "disqualified!"
Why do we Africans love creating problems for ouselves? I'm quite convinced that majority of Nigerians wouldn't support a military takeover. Nor will they welcome another rigged election. Lets keep our fingers crossed.
posted
There is no doubt in my mind that the only way Obasanjo and Atiku can be re-elected is through vote rigging. I am equally certain that they have deployed the machinations for attaining such high crime. And when and if hey temper with the wishes of majority of Nigerians as they are wont to do they would meet such terrible repercussions the like of which they could never have imagined. Let us not forget how Abacha last left Abuja.
posted
Most of the contenders emerged from rigged primary election, so any rigging at the general election is just aluta continua from the primary to the general.
quote:We shall remember not to complain when the ultimate rigging(coup ) takes place
Wacko:
I thought you did not know the difference between coup and rigging. Did I not say that one was the lesser of two evils? Now you say coup is "ultimate rigging." What's the difference?
Posts: 81 | Registered: Mar 2001
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quote:Olu: Rigging is the lesser of two evils. Everyone can rig but everyone cannot carry out coup.
Wacko:On what criteria do you base that assumption? –
Olu: I thought you did not know the difference between coup and rigging. Did I not say that one was the lesser of two evils? Now you say coup is "ultimate rigging." What's the difference?
Olu, Yes, you did say rigging was the lesser of the two evils. The only reason you have given so far is that: Everyone can rig but everyone cannot carry out coup.
That quite clearly does not adequately address the crucial question – what makes one more evil than the other? Lets get down to identifying these criteria.
1. Violence
With reference to Nigeria’s recent history, are coups known to be more violent than rigged elections? You may wish to compare 1983 elections in Ondo and Oyo states to Buhari’s 1983 coup.
2. Quality of leadership Again, with reference to recent history, does the leadership that emerge after a coup differ significantly from that of a rigged election?
3. Add more criteria..... I am sure there are other factors you wish to include, apart from violence and quality of leadership, in trying to help your audience decide which of the evils to embrace.
Posts: 624 | Registered: Mar 2001
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I can now confidently surmise even without presenting any statistics, that based on Violence and Quality of Leadership that CSE is using to qualify OLU's 'lesser evil' premise.
That a coup is definitely in the current Biafranigerian context, a LESSER evil than rigging.
Case closed unless Olu can come up with any other premise
quote:Originally posted by bababoyz: Stop Complaining
Perhaps the most repeated escuse many Yoruba's offer for being okay with OBJ's outright hostility, hatred and marginalization of Igbos and Southeasterners in Biafranigeria is that Igbo's in general were less visible in the fight against Abacha, less targetted as candidates for elimination, and more advantaged in Biafranigeria for Abacha's being there than other Biafranigerians except of course apart from the Northerners.
Somehow, many forget that as usual, Yoruba were part and parcel of the Abacha regime; consider Shonekan, Diya, and many, many others who not only had a healthy hand in the governing of the nation, but also had a healthy hand in the hounding down, torture and assasination of victims of which the much touted NADECO was only one of many (revisit and review Oputa panel hearings for further proof)
It is even held that Abiola himself invited Abacha to overthrow the interim administration of Shonekan in the hopes that he would be ushered in to take what he viewed to be his rightful place. It is also held that with regard to the sponsorship of coups and other such nefarious activities, that Abiola was not necessarily a spring chicken. He! a Yoruba, and about whom all the buzz about June 12th now gloriously revolves.
In their belief that Igbos were not sufficiently represented (in their view) as victims of Abacha especially given the antecedents of the much despised Arthur Nzeribe, it became increasingly necessary to stereotype with the usual malice, hatred and spite, the average Igboman for merely existing, surviving, being.
It became increasingly okay to view Igbos as the new beneficiaries against whom to direct scorn. Scorn for what? scorn for not being the usual target. Not that the Igbo were beneficiaries mind you, but that they failed to be as visible a target as usual.
And so the courting began, a-la "handshake accross the Niger" (the kind that dissapears when the going is good for the Yoruba as we have seen many-a-time past) some Igbos who were already at the avant garde against Abacha and for Abiola had already been standing their ground and didnt need to be invited. Other Igbo (most Igbo) too numb from victimization and marginalization and totally disenfranchised and "politically impotent" (to quote Omoruyi) merely regarded Abacha as another storm to be weathered, another scourge, with his retinue of Yoruba underlings and bottom feeders and so were not swayed by the "us against them" hoopla.
These are the ones. those who gleefully voted for OBJ to herald a new Demon-cratic begining (the recipients of "shut up" or "go to hell") whom OBJ came to neutralize further,just for seeming to have survived Abacha with less wear (afterall while they were buying and selling he was languishing in prison).
Today someone tells us that rigging is a lesser evil than millitary coup. Is'nt it better for me to respect you because you're pointing a gun at me than to
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