quote: how about your role model John Kerry whose lost memory had him twisting his Vietnam war experience to the American people?~~~ Ineba Jimoh
Here is the truth from a man who was there. Don't believe all the lies from the Bush Jr. camp.
Feb. 28, 1969: ON THE DONG CUNG RIVER Anti-Kerry vets not there that day
-By William B. Rood Chicago Tribune Published August 21, 2004
There were three swift boats on the river that day in Vietnam more than 35 years ago—three officers and 15 crew members. Only two of those officers remain to talk about what happened on February 28, 1969.
One is John Kerry, the Democratic presidential candidate who won a Silver Star for what happened on that date. I am the other.
For years, no one asked about those events. But now they are the focus of skirmishing in a presidential election with a group of swift boat veterans and others contending that Kerry didn't deserve the Silver Star for what he did on that day, or the Bronze Star and three Purple Hearts he was awarded for other actions.
Many of us wanted to put it all behind us—the rivers, the ambushes, the killing. Ever since that time, I have refused all requests for interviews about Kerry's service—even those from reporters at the Chicago Tribune, where I work.
But Kerry's critics, armed with stories I know to be untrue, have charged that the accounts of what happened were overblown. The critics have taken pains to say they're not trying to cast doubts on the merit of what others did, but their version of events has splashed doubt on all of us. It's gotten harder and harder for those of us who were there to listen to accounts we know to be untrue, especially when they come from people who were not there.
Even though Kerry's own crew members have backed him, the attacks have continued, and in recent days Kerry has called me and others who were with him in those days, asking that we go public with our accounts.
I can't pretend those calls had no effect on me, but that is not why I am writing this. What matters most to me is that this is hurting crewmen who are not public figures and who deserved to be honored for what they did. My intent is to tell the story here and to never again talk publicly about it.
I was part of the operation that led to Kerry's Silver Star. I have no firsthand knowledge of the events that resulted in his winning the Purple Hearts or the Bronze Star.
But on Feb. 28, 1969, I was officer in charge of PCF-23, one of three swift boats—including Kerry's PCF-94 and Lt. j.g. Donald Droz's PCF-43—that carried Vietnamese regional and Popular Force troops and a Navy demolition team up the Dong Cung, a narrow tributary of the Bay Hap River, to conduct a sweep in the area.
The approach of the noisy 50-foot aluminum boats, each driven by two huge 12-cylinder diesels and loaded down with six crew members, troops and gear, was no secret.
Ambushes were a virtual certainty, and that day was no exception.
Instructions from Kerry
The difference was that Kerry, who had tactical command of that particular operation, had talked to Droz and me beforehand about not responding the way the boats usually did to an ambush.
We agreed that if we were not crippled by the initial volley and had a clear fix on the location of the ambush, we would turn directly into it, focusing the boats' twin .50-caliber machine guns on the attackers and beaching the boats. We told our crews about the plan.
The Viet Cong in the area had come to expect that the heavily loaded boats would lumber on past an ambush, firing at the entrenched attackers, beaching upstream and putting troops ashore to sweep back down on the ambush site. Often, they were long gone by the time the troops got there.
The first time we took fire—the usual rockets and automatic weapons—Kerry ordered a "turn 90" and the three boats roared in on the ambush. It worked. We routed the ambush, killing three of the attackers. The troops, led by an Army adviser, jumped off the boats and began a sweep, which killed another half dozen VC, wounded or captured others and found weapons, blast masks and other supplies used to stage ambushes.
Meanwhile, Kerry ordered our boat to head upstream with his, leaving Droz's boat at the first site.
It happened again, another ambush. And again, Kerry ordered the turn maneuver, and again it worked. As we headed for the riverbank, I remember seeing a loaded B-40 launcher pointed at the boats. It wasn't fired as two men jumped up from their spider holes.
We called Droz's boat up to assist us, and Kerry, followed by one member of his crew, jumped ashore and chased a VC behind a hooch—a thatched hut—maybe 15 yards inland from the ambush site. Some who were there that day recall the man being wounded as he ran. Neither I nor Jerry Leeds, our boat's leading petty officer with whom I've checked my recollection of all these events, recalls that, which is no surprise. Recollections of those who go through experiences like that frequently differ.
With our troops involved in the sweep of the first ambush site, Richard Lamberson, a member of my crew, and I also went ashore to search the area. I was checking out the inside of the hooch when I heard gunfire nearby.
Not long after that, Kerry returned, reporting that he had killed the man he chased behind the hooch. He also had picked up a loaded B-40 rocket launcher, which we took back to our base in An Thoi after the operation.
John O'Neill, author of a highly critical account of Kerry's Vietnam service, describes the man Kerry chased as a "teenager" in a "loincloth." I have no idea how old the gunner Kerry chased that day was, but both Leeds and I recall that he was a grown man, dressed in the kind of garb the VC usually wore.
The man Kerry chased was not the "lone" attacker at that site, as O'Neill suggests. There were others who fled. There was also firing from the tree line well behind the spider holes and at one point, from the opposite riverbank as well. It was not the work of just one attacker.
Our initial reports of the day's action caused an immediate response from our task force headquarters in Cam Ranh Bay.
Congratulatory message
Known over radio circuits by the call sign "Latch," then-Capt. and now retired Rear Adm. Roy Hoffmann, the task force commander, fired off a message congratulating the three swift boats, saying at one point that the tactic of charging the ambushes was a "shining example of completely overwhelming the enemy" and that it "may be the most efficacious method of dealing with small numbers of ambushers."
Hoffmann has become a leading critic of Kerry's and now says that what the boats did on that day demonstrated Kerry's inclination to be impulsive to a fault.
Our decision to use that tactic under the right circumstances was not impulsive but was the result of discussions well beforehand and a mutual agreement of all three boat officers.
It was also well within the aggressive tradition that was embraced by the late Adm. Elmo Zumwalt, then commander of U.S. Naval Forces, Vietnam. Months before that day in February, a fellow boat officer, Michael Bernique, was summoned to Saigon to explain to top Navy commanders why he had made an unauthorized run up the Giang Thanh River, which runs along the Vietnam-Cambodia border. Bernique, who speaks French fluently, had been told by a source in Ha Tien at the mouth of the river that a VC tax collector was operating upstream.
Ignoring the prohibition against it, Bernique and his crew went upstream and routed the VC, pursuing and killing several.
Instead of facing disciplinary action as he had expected, Bernique was given the Silver Star, and Zumwalt ordered other swifts, which had largely patrolled coastal waters, into the rivers.
The decision sent a clear message, underscored repeatedly by Hoffmann's congratulatory messages, that aggressive patrolling was expected and that well-timed, if unconventional, tactics like Bernique's were encouraged.
What we did on Feb. 28, 1969, was well in line with the tone set by our top commanders.
Zumwalt made that clear when he flew down to our base at An Thoi off the southern tip of Vietnam to pin the Silver Star on Kerry and assorted Bronze Stars and commendation medals on the rest of us.
Error in citation
My Bronze Star citation, signed by Zumwalt, praised the charge tactic we used that day, saying the VC were "caught completely off guard."
There's at least one mistake in that citation. It incorrectly identifies the river where the main action occurred, a reminder that such documents were often done in haste and sometimes authored for their signers by staffers. It's a cautionary note for those trying to piece it all together. There's no final authority on something that happened so long ago—not the documents and not even the strained recollections of those of us who were there.
But I know that what some people are saying now is wrong. While they mean to hurt Kerry, what they're saying impugns others who are not in the public eye.
Men like Larry Lee, who was on our bow with an M-60 machine gun as we charged the riverbank, Kenneth Martin, who was in the .50-caliber gun tub atop our boat, and Benjamin Cueva, our engineman, who was at our aft gun mount suppressing the fire from the opposite bank.
Wayne Langhoffer and the other crewmen on Droz's boat went through even worse on April 12, 1969, when they saw Droz killed in a brutal ambush that left PCF-43 an abandoned pile of wreckage on the banks of the Duong Keo River. That was just a few months after the birth of his only child, Tracy.
The survivors of all these events are scattered across the country now.
Jerry Leeds lives in a tiny Kansas town where he built and sold a successful printing business. He owns a beautiful home with a lawn that sweeps to the edge of a small lake, which he also owns. Every year, flights of purple martins return to the stately birdhouses on the tall poles in his back yard.
Cueva, recently retired, has raised three daughters and is beloved by his neighbors for all the years he spent keeping their cars running. Lee is a senior computer programmer in Kentucky, and Lamberson finished a second military career in the Army.
posted
More written documentation to prove that the so-called Swift-Boat people are a bunch of liars.
A rational person after reconciling what they said immediately after the event happened with what they are saying will conclude that they are being paid off by the Bush Jr. camp.
On Feb. 28, 1969, three U.S. Navy Swift Boats were involved in an ambush on Vietnam’s Dong Cung, a tributary of the Bay Hap River. John Kerry earned the Silver Star for his part in the raid, in which Kerry’s aggressive tactics helped thwart two ambushes and rout two enemy positions.
The message above was sent from the office of Capt. Roy Hoffmann, the task force commander, commending the Swift boats’ action for the “extremely successful raid.” Hoffmann, now a retired rear admiral, has recently appeared in campaign ads that question Kerry’s Vietnam record.
I hope I am not being presumptuous by suggesting that dummies as seen by this Ineba Jimoh efulefu's one-liner be banned from the board.My reason for proffering this is simple, valued space is wasted by someone whose posts does not inculcate anything meaningful. This chap thinks we're here for some moonlight play or owambe/miliki dance crap, a Yoroba usual past time with each successful stealing of government funds.
___________________ BIAFRA: The land of my ancestors now, yesterday and always. So it will be! Posts: 2483 | From: Ala Igbo | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
Since you ask one-liners be banned, bear in mind the axe will also fall on your comrades-- Okwyonwuka, NwaBiafra, Wacko, Biafra, Chima Njoku, Nrozara, Chinyere--whose one-liner make me wanna puke.
MeBiafran, I think you need Prozac for your severe depression. It's now obvious.
___________________ No Man is an Island Posts: 60 | From: New Haven, Conn. USA | Registered: Jan 2004
| IP: Logged
Why are you so slow? Guys, what's the matter with this yoroba taut? Listen up boy! I've seen your type before, I mean the kind that was smuggled into the country just for stealing credit cards and check books from the mail.
Read "addy" and yours and see if you notice the intellectual difference. This is the first assignment after which I decide if it's not a waste of time to engage you. Okido?
___________________ BIAFRA: The land of my ancestors now, yesterday and always. So it will be! Posts: 2483 | From: Ala Igbo | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
posted
I sympathise with president Bush.This man John Kerry is either not fully knowledgeble on the dangers faced by America or is playng politics with the real dangers that prompted the action taken against Saddam Hussein. War is never an easy concept to convince people about.It is horrible and it is painful.President Franklin Roosevelt also had a tough time convincing Americans that it was in the national interest to join the world war 2 after the temporary defeat of the British army in North Africa.Imagine what fate the world would have had if America had allowed Germany to swallow England before deciding to join the fight because it had become obvious hitler was now heading for their jugular.Hitler could have brought the war to American soil and won. George Bush is only blamed for Iraq because those murderous fanatics from all parts of the arab world have gone to Iraq to forment mayhem.Someday,information would surface on where Saddam hid his weapons of mass destruction and the world would come to realize the wisdom in George Bush`s action now. Isreal have proved time and again that the only way to reason with the fanatics is to show force and strenght.That is the only way Isreal have continued to survive in the middle east without declaring itself an islamic state.Because as for the fanatics,you are either a muslim and therefore a brother or you are an infidel and therefore demands that a good muslims anywhere should kill you.Should he die in the process? He would go to heaven and marry ten virgins.Saddam hussein instead of holding peace talks or encouraging the reduction of violence in the middle east,was busy spending Iraqi money ($25,000) dollars each on the families of any suicide bombers.While his people lacked simple portable water or a functional hospital system.
We cannot blame George Bush for using his country`s military for what it was designed- Defend America from all her enemies.France,Germany and Russia might have opposed because they really knew that was the best thing to do for terrorists would really not attack them except if they sided with their(Terrorists) targets-America & Isreal.Afterall, the lead hijacker of 911,Mohammed Atta lived in Hamburg ,Germany while planning his murderous attacks.Russia knowing Chechen terrorist would rather attack Russia than anywhere else have taken action there defying world opinion too.France defied world opinion to develop it`s own nuclear weapons in the sixties despite assurances of protection guaranteed by it`s ally America. They(France and Germany) are really also saving their own skin now by pretending not to know what dangers America`s inaction would mean for America`s future security. When you take time to peruse on the situation,you would see that the Iraq war,though tragic was indeed a neccesary evil.
You make me laugh out loud, honestly. It doesn't take much to figure out you're a career 419er, and my advice to you: Just keep up to your game and watch your back while it last, young man. I think bababoyz was right when he said all you Ibos are phony. Now go hang yourself Mr. Ike and odu man.
By the way, was it you that gave me two stars? How meanspirited could you be when I gave you five stars?
___________________ No Man is an Island Posts: 60 | From: New Haven, Conn. USA | Registered: Jan 2004
| IP: Logged
posted
Jimoh,If you were sent here by Afenifere or so to whip your usual tribalism and ngabati-ngbati sentiments,well i don`t have time to join issues with incurable tribalists. Well,You can unsubscribe to this forum if you don`t like your star.I assure you that Nobody would miss you.It`s a shame that Yolobas always insinuate a tribal or monetary link in even the most harmless personal opinion.By the way,tell me if/why you muslims preach and practice the killing of 'infidels' as a legitimate obligation of a good muslim?
The master credit card stealer, himself. You must prove to me that one, you're not one of those cheap barbers that somehow was smuggled in by your Houston, Texas based kingpin. Two, you must prove to us that you truly understand words of English for any meaningful exchange to continue. The keyword is understand not write but your ability to comprehend, which I'm sure is minuscule. And three, you must tell us if Oduduwa "landed" from heaven shackled or was a common village thief who ran away from old kingdom of bini. Now go do your research, oops, sorry I meant homework for you little boy!
njiko umuigbo
quote: We cannot blame George Bush for using his country`s military for what it was designed- Defend America from all her enemies.
The glaring problem with this position is nowhere has it been proven that Iraq was ready to attack/invade the U.S. It’s also a known and stated fact that none of the nineteen hijackers were Iraqi, my dear. So where’s the equity and justice in bush's actions? Why not invade saudi, Pakistan, Morocco, Jordan so on and on? See!
___________________ BIAFRA: The land of my ancestors now, yesterday and always. So it will be! Posts: 2483 | From: Ala Igbo | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
posted
You see,even if we are scared of admitting the obvious fact that islamic fundamentalism is simply a later day form of Nazism.It is all written in their doctrine.Like Nazism preaches death to all non members of the arryan master race,the fanatics preach death to all non believers. If Saddam Hussein could pay $25,000 dollars to families of suicide bombers,build scud missiles to reach the range of Isreal and beyond,expel United Nations arms inspectors from inspecting his weapons programme,then he deserved what he got. It would have been catastrophic to have continued playing hide and seek games with Saddam until one day he is confirmed to possess a nuclear bomb.From his antecedents and narcissism,no body would doubt his geniune desire to use that devastating weapon to anihilate his enemies.It is better that the US erred on the side of caution than await the arrival of that dooms day scenario. Therefore,if Saddam knew he really had no clandestine plans to develop those weapons,he should not have continued to expel the UN inspectors who would have given him a clean bill of health that he didn`t have any WMD programme.The second gulf war would then have been reasonably unnecessary.
quote: If Saddam Hussein could pay $25,000 dollars to families of suicide bombers,…
Arafat? I’m with you if you pay attention my qualms is with the double standard application. Doesn't Arafat support and pay out reward money to suicide killers? Precisely! Are you aware that no American was ever killed, kidnapped or maimed in Iraq prior to the illegal and unjust invasion? Don’t we think Iran is more a danger to the U.S. than Iraq and while we’re at it, how about the 1979 Teheran embassy hostage situation. As for the expulsion of U.N. inspectors, it was all about bluff for Saddam who by the way I care not about. It’s all about equity.
___________________ BIAFRA: The land of my ancestors now, yesterday and always. So it will be! Posts: 2483 | From: Ala Igbo | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
Swift boat or no swift boat, by the time we are done with that waffling John Kerry, even you Democrats will not want him as your president. Kerry has been given plenty of opportunity to tell Americans how he differs from the president on the most important issues, and Kerry has waffled. Well, waffle is not on the White House menu, but I hear that some people like Ketchup on their waffle. Kerry will have plenty of time to enjoy that concoction come November 3, 2004.
___________________ No Biafran will be permitted to play Mother Theresa to the Yoruba and Hausa-Fulani, but play Osama Bin Laden to the Igbo or Biafrans! Posts: 1182 | Registered: Mar 2001
| IP: Logged
The last time I checked this thread is about Republican Convention. So can we discuss what is happening at the Republican convention?
With that in mind the real question is Where are the Republicans?
There seems to be two Republican parties - the republican party that is in power - and the pretty face that they are trotting out at the convention. They are bringing out the liberal Republicans like John McCain and Arnold Schwarzenegger and Rudy Giuliani who have no power and hiding the people who are really in charge.
The real Republicans are hidden away. We don't see John Ashcroft speaking on Civil Liberties. Where is Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, Allen Keyes, the Reverend Sun Mung Moon, and Pat Buchanan? Where are the people behind the Republican energy policy like Kenneth Lay or Prince Vandar? Where is Donald Rumsfield and Paul Wolfowitz to talk about why we should torture prisoners? Where are the noecons like Tom Delay and Newt Gingrich? These are the people who wrote the Republican platform and shape Republican policy.
It looks to me like the Republicans are trying to put lipstick on a pig, showing people what they think they want to see rather than the way they really are. Republicans don't think American people will vote for them if they showed who was really in charge - and on that point I agree with them.
As the Republican convention continues, GOP is hiding it's real face from the public. They trot out McCain and Schwarzenegger to put a pretty face to the public. The NEOCONS are being pushed into the background as they try to pretend to be reasonable. Even Dick Cheney the biggest of all the NEOCONS failed to speak like a NEOCON that he is during his speech last night.
If the GOP were honest they would be trotting out the real power behind their party. Ken Lay of Enron would be a keynote speaker. The Reverend Sun Mung Moon would be in prime time. Why not have John Ashcroft talk about civil liberties? Lets get Rummy to talk about why torturing prisioners is a good idea. Prince Vandar should speak about why high oil prices is good for America. Where's Tom Delay? Where's Newt. Gingrich? Where's Jerry Falwell? Where's Pat Robbertson? They should have a representative for Haliburton there - oh wait - they do have one. And - some of Bush's business partners in the Bin Laden family.
___________________ BIAFRA MUST RISE AGAIN. LONG LIVE BIAFRA!! Posts: 1080 | From: California, USA. | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged
The problem with you democrats is that you can't seem to make up your mind. I thought you democrats claimed that Dick Cheney was the leader of the so-called NeoCons. Was Cheney not on the podium yesterday delivering a powerful speech? You need to make up your mind; are the "NeoCons" hiding or are they just refusing to speak the way you think they should? Yesterday, Cheney all but called Kerry a Sissy who wants to fight a "sensitive" war on terror.
By the way, I believe that only a sissy will fight a "sensitive" war on terror. In spite of Kerry's military citations and medals, he is increasingly looking like a sissy because he has been whipped into submission to Bush's war policy. By the end of tonight, America will have a very different impression of Kerry than the one the Democrats painted at Bostson. Compare that with Kerry who had the opportunity to define his opponent but failed to so. I guess Kerry was running a "sensitive" convention.
I still have not decided which of Kerry or Bush will get my vote come November. If at that time I still cannot decide, I will vote to keep things the way they are; I will vote for Dubya. If Kerry wants to impress me, he should go on his hands and knees to James Carville and Bill Clinton, two persons who know how to even the playing field when it comes to fighting an aggressive opponent and his party. Thus far, I am underwhelmed by Kerry.
___________________ No Biafran will be permitted to play Mother Theresa to the Yoruba and Hausa-Fulani, but play Osama Bin Laden to the Igbo or Biafrans! Posts: 1182 | Registered: Mar 2001
| IP: Logged
quote:Was Cheney not on the podium yesterday delivering a powerful speech? ~~Damian
What was so powerful about his speech? What did the NEOCON Cheney speak about? did speak about fiscal responsibility? What NEOCON ideas did he speak about last night? I guess none since he was too busy hiding from his real self. The only thing I saw last night from Cheney and the Republicans was deception!
___________________ BIAFRA MUST RISE AGAIN. LONG LIVE BIAFRA!! Posts: 1080 | From: California, USA. | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged
quote: I still have not decided which of Kerry or Bush will get my vote come November. If at that time I still cannot decide, I will vote to keep things the way they are; I will vote for Dubya.
It's sad when folks should really bend over backwards to convince you to have a rethink they continue at daggers drawn. Every vote should be important to Kerry and his handlers therefore I expect us to convince these gentlemen (Anaedo, Damian etc) who though are not too impressed with Kerry still exhibit a little neutrality. I observed!
I hereon plead with our brother Damian to reconsider his intended vote for georgie bush. Nwa nne anyi, let's give Kerry a chance since georgie blew his with the triple deficit and worldwide unrest due to his unpolished style of relating to other world leaders. Could you imagine this chap giving what appeared to be orders to French, German and Chinese presidents before his ill-advised invasion of Iraq? Vote for Kerry, "D."
___________________ BIAFRA: The land of my ancestors now, yesterday and always. So it will be! Posts: 2483 | From: Ala Igbo | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
